Since this subforum is called "DCS World & Other Flight Sims", I thought I'd ask my question here. Feel free to shoot me down with an AA gun if appropriate.
As I'm the proud new owner of a Thrustmaster HOTAS Flight X, I decided to give IL-2: 1946 (with HSFX) another try. I still find the game to be structured in a way that pretty much tells newbies to go back to their Crimson Skies or H.A.W.X., but I don't want to give up as fast as last time. I find the training section pretty useless, because it doesn't seem to let the player try out the thing he's just been shown. I also have no idea whether there's a suggested campaign that teaches the basics, but I'm happy to have found the "Straight from the farm" fan campaign, which is helping me with my basics.
Is there anything in the game that is useful when it comes to learning the ropes, that actually gives some feedback or guides through the single steps? Are there fan campaigns similar to "Straight from the farm" that act as a tutorial? Or should I just check the internet for fan guides and the like and hope for the best? Any help from the Collective would be much appreciated.
IL-2 newbie
Moderator: oldhosts
IL-2 newbie
"Until now we scraped along the ground like rats, but from now on, we soar. Like eagles. Yeah. LIKE EAGLES... ON... POGO STICKS." - Grim Fandango
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Black Mamba
- Posts: 335
- Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 12:11 pm
Re: IL-2 newbie
Disclaimer: I haven't flown the original IL-2s in ages, so I might be a bit outdated here.
First thing first, if you haven't done so already, take some time to properly set up your joystick. Usually good controls settings make a huge difference, and you go from struggling to keep your crate in the air to actually struggle to perform maneuvers immediately. A quick search should bring a few examples of settings used by other players, but you'll probably have to fiddle a bit with them to get to something that suits your needs. The most important are the non-linearity and sensitivity settings.
As a side note, as I own a HOTAS X myself, you probably want to lock the twist axis on the stick and use the thing on the throttle to control yaw. I find it to be easier to coordinate (if you don't have a set of rudder pedals, that is).
Now, if by basics you mean basic flight procedures (take-offs, landings, carrier landings, stall recovery, basic maneuvers), IIRC "Straight from the farm" is one of the best things around. In any case, you can have a look a this guide, as it's pretty comprehensive to get started.
Then of course, you can download a bunch of training missions from mission4today.
IL-2, especially after so many years of modding and additions, is indeed somewhat overwhelming. The sheer quantity of planes you'll be tempted to fly might actually be a bad thing at first, I'd personally recommend to stick to a select fews, then expand when you feel really comfortable with those. If anything, after two hours of failing at the P-51D, getting back to your trusty old P-40 is good for the troops morale.
Then, if you're looking more at improving your fighting skills, I strongly recommend you have a look at In Pursuit, that guide is simply awesome. It's quite long though, so you may want to fly a bit in betwen a few pages of reading. So you don't die of boredom.
In any case, whatever you want to practice, the QMB is your friend. Abuse it. Then, when you feel you can reliably have fun in a plane, I suggest you hop on to some servers and fight some actual players, because as much as shooting bots is a great tool to practice, it can get kind of "gamey" at some point, and a bit repetitive. Keep practicing, there is nothing like the thrill of shooting down another player in the end! (Or to get shot. Happens. A lot.)
Obviously, the best way to learn is to have somebody guide you. I still don't have my gaming gear with me (hopefully I'll get all that back around christmas), so not much flying outside war thunder for me, but I know for example Zitron owns IL-2.
As a final word, if you really feel like diving into the flight sim world, I'd recommend having a look at IL-2: Cliffs of Dover. It's probably not that expensive on Steam nowadays, and it's without a doubt the best WWII flight sim around, provided you install the Team Fusion unofficial patches. The next patch, which should arrive in the beginning of next year, will apparently bring a new theater of operations too.
IL-2 BOS is probably a bit more accessible, but still very expensive, and DCS is probably not the best place to start.
Good luck!
First thing first, if you haven't done so already, take some time to properly set up your joystick. Usually good controls settings make a huge difference, and you go from struggling to keep your crate in the air to actually struggle to perform maneuvers immediately. A quick search should bring a few examples of settings used by other players, but you'll probably have to fiddle a bit with them to get to something that suits your needs. The most important are the non-linearity and sensitivity settings.
As a side note, as I own a HOTAS X myself, you probably want to lock the twist axis on the stick and use the thing on the throttle to control yaw. I find it to be easier to coordinate (if you don't have a set of rudder pedals, that is).
Now, if by basics you mean basic flight procedures (take-offs, landings, carrier landings, stall recovery, basic maneuvers), IIRC "Straight from the farm" is one of the best things around. In any case, you can have a look a this guide, as it's pretty comprehensive to get started.
Then of course, you can download a bunch of training missions from mission4today.
IL-2, especially after so many years of modding and additions, is indeed somewhat overwhelming. The sheer quantity of planes you'll be tempted to fly might actually be a bad thing at first, I'd personally recommend to stick to a select fews, then expand when you feel really comfortable with those. If anything, after two hours of failing at the P-51D, getting back to your trusty old P-40 is good for the troops morale.
Then, if you're looking more at improving your fighting skills, I strongly recommend you have a look at In Pursuit, that guide is simply awesome. It's quite long though, so you may want to fly a bit in betwen a few pages of reading. So you don't die of boredom.
In any case, whatever you want to practice, the QMB is your friend. Abuse it. Then, when you feel you can reliably have fun in a plane, I suggest you hop on to some servers and fight some actual players, because as much as shooting bots is a great tool to practice, it can get kind of "gamey" at some point, and a bit repetitive. Keep practicing, there is nothing like the thrill of shooting down another player in the end! (Or to get shot. Happens. A lot.)
Obviously, the best way to learn is to have somebody guide you. I still don't have my gaming gear with me (hopefully I'll get all that back around christmas), so not much flying outside war thunder for me, but I know for example Zitron owns IL-2.
As a final word, if you really feel like diving into the flight sim world, I'd recommend having a look at IL-2: Cliffs of Dover. It's probably not that expensive on Steam nowadays, and it's without a doubt the best WWII flight sim around, provided you install the Team Fusion unofficial patches. The next patch, which should arrive in the beginning of next year, will apparently bring a new theater of operations too.
IL-2 BOS is probably a bit more accessible, but still very expensive, and DCS is probably not the best place to start.
Good luck!
Re: IL-2 newbie
Thanks a lot - that's a fantastic starting point! I've also got Cliffs of Dover (since it was only €9.99), but I'll wait with that one until next year when I've built my new PC. In the meantime I'm trying to see how well I take to IL-2 1946. Depending on how much I'll end up spending on my new build, I think I might throw in a set of Saitek rudder pedals, not least since I also quite like helicopter flight in the Arma games and am curious to see how much rudder pedals help with that.
Anyway, this is a lot to go on for now, so thanks again!
Anyway, this is a lot to go on for now, so thanks again!
"Until now we scraped along the ground like rats, but from now on, we soar. Like eagles. Yeah. LIKE EAGLES... ON... POGO STICKS." - Grim Fandango
Re: IL-2 newbie
IL2 1946 used to be my Arma. I played it online with hyperlobby, and there are people still playing it. We had massive coop/adv missions it was awesome.
IL2 1946 is much easier than DCS to get into (apart from Flaming Cliffs). However because you are flying old prop planes they require more skill to fly, you need to worry about torque effects, engine management, nasty stalls, and trim constantly. If you are new to flight sims, I would suggest you start with the P-38, it has counter-rotating props which eliminates torque, and tricycle landing gear for easier take off and landing.
Even though the modelling is IL2 is not as detailed as DCS, it's got everything you need to learn actually flying rather than "how do even turn this on?". If you want to be good at fighting you need to know your aircraft, e.g. what speed should I fly to get the best climb rate, what speed do I turn the tightest, what altitude do I fly the fastest. (IL2 Compare will answer these questions)
IL2 1946 is much easier than DCS to get into (apart from Flaming Cliffs). However because you are flying old prop planes they require more skill to fly, you need to worry about torque effects, engine management, nasty stalls, and trim constantly. If you are new to flight sims, I would suggest you start with the P-38, it has counter-rotating props which eliminates torque, and tricycle landing gear for easier take off and landing.
Even though the modelling is IL2 is not as detailed as DCS, it's got everything you need to learn actually flying rather than "how do even turn this on?". If you want to be good at fighting you need to know your aircraft, e.g. what speed should I fly to get the best climb rate, what speed do I turn the tightest, what altitude do I fly the fastest. (IL2 Compare will answer these questions)
Re: IL-2 newbie
If you want a campaign that starts out by letting you train a bit you can join the Finnish air force!
The campaign "Famous Fokkers of the Winter War" was my introduction to 1946, and playing through it helped me get my bearings. There are still things you have to poke around the internet to notice/understand, but it gives you a nice environment to do so in. Just click "Pilot Career", select the Finnish air force, and then choose it from the "Career" drop down menu on the next page.
Ooooh man now i want to fly this again as well...
The campaign "Famous Fokkers of the Winter War" was my introduction to 1946, and playing through it helped me get my bearings. There are still things you have to poke around the internet to notice/understand, but it gives you a nice environment to do so in. Just click "Pilot Career", select the Finnish air force, and then choose it from the "Career" drop down menu on the next page.
Ooooh man now i want to fly this again as well...
Re: IL-2 newbie
Thanks, zitron and audiox! All this info definitely makes it easier for me to approach that monster of a simulation. Looking forward to putting in some more air time!
"Until now we scraped along the ground like rats, but from now on, we soar. Like eagles. Yeah. LIKE EAGLES... ON... POGO STICKS." - Grim Fandango
Re: IL-2 newbie
P.S.: I think the issue of trimming is still somewhat nebulous to me - I understand what it does but not necessarily when and how to use it - but I guess that can wait until I've become more comfortable with more basic things.
"Until now we scraped along the ground like rats, but from now on, we soar. Like eagles. Yeah. LIKE EAGLES... ON... POGO STICKS." - Grim Fandango
Re: IL-2 newbie
Most aircraft are designed such that if it's properly trimmed, it will fly straight and level stably when you let go of the controls. This is important because:
Why trim:
1. It reduces your work load so you can look around, look at the map, etc. without having to fight the controls since the plane will basically fly itself
2. Being able to fly straight and level properly is obviously pretty important, considering that is what you will be doing in an aircraft for the most of the time, it is also important for accurate navigation
3. A properly trimmed aircraft will have less drag. This is particularly important for propeller planes because without rudder trim the torque effect and the propeller flow tend to cause your plane to yaw (like IL2 Tokyo drift!), which increases drag. On the intarwebs, some people will accuse you of hacking because you can fly faster than them in the same plane just because you are trimmed (true story)!
When to trim: whenever you need to fly level or do a constant manoeuvre (e.g. constant climb), even though you might be trimmed for one configuration, if something changes (e.g. speed changed, altitude changed, attitude changed) you will need to trim again.
When you don't need to trim: some people will say you always need to trim, but I would say if you are in a dogfight then there are more important things to worry about. But even in a dogfight an expert will be able use trim to his/her advantage. At least you should go into a fight trimmed.
How to trim (for level flight):
1. Pitch: use your trim controls so that when you centre your stick the rate of climb indicator reads 0
2. Yaw: use your rudder trim so that when your centre your rudder the side slip indicator (thing with the ball in a glass tube) has the ball centred
3. Roll (some planes don't have this): use trim so that when you centre your stick the wings are level (look outside or at artificial horizon)
Why trim:
1. It reduces your work load so you can look around, look at the map, etc. without having to fight the controls since the plane will basically fly itself
2. Being able to fly straight and level properly is obviously pretty important, considering that is what you will be doing in an aircraft for the most of the time, it is also important for accurate navigation
3. A properly trimmed aircraft will have less drag. This is particularly important for propeller planes because without rudder trim the torque effect and the propeller flow tend to cause your plane to yaw (like IL2 Tokyo drift!), which increases drag. On the intarwebs, some people will accuse you of hacking because you can fly faster than them in the same plane just because you are trimmed (true story)!
When to trim: whenever you need to fly level or do a constant manoeuvre (e.g. constant climb), even though you might be trimmed for one configuration, if something changes (e.g. speed changed, altitude changed, attitude changed) you will need to trim again.
When you don't need to trim: some people will say you always need to trim, but I would say if you are in a dogfight then there are more important things to worry about. But even in a dogfight an expert will be able use trim to his/her advantage. At least you should go into a fight trimmed.
How to trim (for level flight):
1. Pitch: use your trim controls so that when you centre your stick the rate of climb indicator reads 0
2. Yaw: use your rudder trim so that when your centre your rudder the side slip indicator (thing with the ball in a glass tube) has the ball centred
3. Roll (some planes don't have this): use trim so that when you centre your stick the wings are level (look outside or at artificial horizon)
Re: IL-2 newbie
Thanks, zitron, that's a great help!
"Until now we scraped along the ground like rats, but from now on, we soar. Like eagles. Yeah. LIKE EAGLES... ON... POGO STICKS." - Grim Fandango
Re: IL-2 newbie
P.S.: I went and ordered myself a set of Saitek rudders as an early Christmas present. Now look what you've done, IL-2! Will have to read up a bit on what sort of control setups work best with the number of buttons and axes I'll have at my disposal.
Also, very much looking forward to Elite: Dangerous coming out so I can HOTAS and TrackIR that one!
Also, very much looking forward to Elite: Dangerous coming out so I can HOTAS and TrackIR that one!
"Until now we scraped along the ground like rats, but from now on, we soar. Like eagles. Yeah. LIKE EAGLES... ON... POGO STICKS." - Grim Fandango